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No Point Upgrading Other Inferior Unis, Well Played Con


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#41
Hatchford

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ONE month to max out ONE weapon is NOT a fair number


Edited by Hatchford, 18 March 2015 - 08:35 PM.

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#42
Zingman

Zingman
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Nice way to correct yourself :P

 

One week for one level is fair to me, for a player that isn't buying fuel.   Raiders can probably do double if not triple that if they just focus on raiding fuel generators (and getting better at raiding before they turn competitive).

 

If you want to go faster, buy fuel.

 

That's the game model this game has allways had.


Edited by Zingman, 18 March 2015 - 08:41 PM.

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#43
BoShankus

BoShankus
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and you think having to be that choosey is good for the game? spend months and months for ONE investment for the future? 

 

You think continuing to allow upgrades for basically free is good for the game?  That every single upgrade should be attainable for nothing?


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#44
Hatchford

Hatchford
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its 110% better then what we have now... then people could spend fuel on speeding up raids or missions during looter runs.. so yeah.. its better then this....


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#45
BoShankus

BoShankus
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its 110% better then what we have now... then people could spend fuel on speeding up raids or missions during looter runs.. so yeah.. its better then this....

 

They can still do that.  

 

I still don't understand why you think you get all your upgrades for what amounts to pennies....and saying that getting that would allow you to do other things simply isn't a reason.


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#46
Ivan

Ivan
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Sort of agree with you zingman in a way, but not quite.

 


OVERALL though, I think that Con should slash ALL his prices hugely. I think the game would work much better if we all were spending fuel hard and fast on loads of stuff, rather than saving for months on end. If upgrading stuff was like 50 fuel per level at top level. I would upgrade the shit out of everything. Same with return times. If it was like 10 fuel to return from a raid, I would NEVER wait the full 2 hours. Im sure I would spend more that way than I ever did with the current system.

 

1. he agrees that he doesnt with you Zingman

 

2. last 30 mins = only 15 fuel (wink,wink)


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#47
Harpago

Harpago
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The good times came to an end.

 

I did wonder how long Con would watch his ongoing financial statistics and come to the conclusion the player base upgrading almost everything at one fuel point a level was having a dig at his running costs and projected profit margin, the latter of which he has to have, this being a private enterprise, for any of this to continue. 

 

Taking into account the guy, and his employees, all have rents to pay and things to pay for in life, like having a life beyond their office time working on this game so many of you apparently enjoy for free, I think 80% seems pretty reasonable.

 

I'll probably be deleting all the latest premium boxes I find though, and fuel boxes, given I hate what's in them, so I shall sit out upgrading for a while until cooler stuff comes along unless I find truly awesome stuff and my lack of patience gets the better of me.

 

But yeah, back to how it was, upgrading only the best stuff you find. Though now we have a return on the bent uniques, and rares, we find in infamous gear. So not that bad :)


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#48
gansai

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I've never spent a cent on this game.  I learned my lesson years ago to never pay for a game that's still in beta, because things change all the time, and some of those things might push me towards not playing anymore.  Maybe some of you other people have finally learned this lesson now too.

 

Yes, having to invest some time to achieve something you want is completely fair.  Not sure why you think differently.  You must be used to getting stuff handed to you all your life.  What's that silver spoon taste like?

 

 

 

And gansai.....if you are making around $1000 a month, why would the idea to spend $100 of that on upgrading a weapon in any game even cross your mind?  You might have some issues with budgeting....

i would never spend 100$ on upgrading never but why would con make upgrading over expensive that you need atleast 20$ worth of fuel just to upgrade 1 lvl at the base cost?

Edit: And seriously i'm not agreeing that 1 fuel crafting cost are fair i just want the base fuel cost reduced to a fair amount not ove expensive base fuel cost.thats why most of us giving our stuff to upgrader to upgrade because the real problem is the base fuel cost is way too expensive for normal player like me to upgrade.


Edited by gansai, 19 March 2015 - 03:00 AM.

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#49
Sandunes

Sandunes
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If you REALLY wanna compete at the top of the raiding game (although you can raid effectively with less for sure) you need 10 lvl 50 uni LR and 10 lvl 50 uni armour.

 

so thats 20 weeks if you happened to find them all at lvl 49.

 

Lets pretend the average lvl for finding a high lvl uni is lvl 47. Thats 60 weeks. 1 year just to get all your goodies to where they need to be.

 

I am rolling up to my 10 month anniversary playing this game. I am forced by my real life schedule to be a part timer around here, especially the last 5 months.

 

That said, I have yet to see a Unique .50 cal.  Further, I have scavenged one unique long rifle ever...  Armor has been slightly more forgiving. I do have one raider worthy unique armor so far.

 

10 months in  and:  1 armor/0 rifles acquired.

 

I did tear down the white flag briefly to attempt raiding. Once I saw the quality of weaponry being deployed against me, and the futility of trying to participate, up went the white flag...

 

So for this player at least, whatever changes just took place are just as irrelevant as however it was prior.

 

You want more raiders?

 

Overhaul the raid mechanics entirely or up the drop rate on unique long rifles by a factor of 100...

 

 

*shrugs*

 

I suppose I could have committed to getting some equipment while the 1 fuel upgrade silliness was happening, but by the time all that happened, I was past caring.


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#50
tvsnake

tvsnake
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There was no cap.  95% was the old "limit" when Trick or Treat boxes came out, but only because the premium boxes didn't exist yet    If there's one thing Con is consistent about is he always forgets to put a cap.  First he forgot a level cap so players got up to the mid 40s when content only went up to level 20.  Then he forgot an inventory cap, so players nearly crashed the server with the database load.   Then he forgot a cap on projectile resist, so players were crafting armors which made them invincible.   Now we've got a cap on crafting -- which should have been put in from the start, certainly after it was pointed out the second time, if not the first.

 

= a lack of vision from our developers. Or only greed?

 

Anyway, with the upgrades from the last couple of months this game is dedicated only for the wallet warriors.


Edited by tvsnake, 19 March 2015 - 04:36 PM.

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#51
Buue

Buue
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Guys, just stop complaining. 80% is already generous enough as it is, Con could have reduced it to an even lower number, like 70% or 60%. Con has to make money, and yes, this update may reduce the premium key sales, which in theory would reduce the amount of money Con makes from this game. But, we are not Con, and we do not know what the finicial situation is. Con did what he thought is best and got backlash for it, and listened. He listened! That's more than I can say for some of the people on this forum complaining about this update. This game was a free to play in the begginng and will always be. One who plays a free to play cannot expect the benefits of a paid game. It seems that a lot of you guys forgot that. A good free to play is one where you can get far in the game and acess most of the game without spending a single cent. This game fits that in my honest opinion. This is my two cents


I agree, if you guys say otherwise, it isn't Con that is a "corrupt monster", it is all of you guys who love getting free or cheap upgrades that are corrupt.

Edited by SpicyBlobs, 19 March 2015 - 11:59 PM.

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#52
Hatchford

Hatchford
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It made the game more easily accessible by players who were more then casual but not quite hardcore... is it really that bad to want a larger player base of more active players? cause that's what it created... the prohibitive cost of upgrades has a trickledown effect onto the trade market that makes high level competition more of an old boys club then it already is which is just not healthy...

 

and none of this would be an issue if the cost of upgrading wasn't prohibitively high in the first place....


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#53
Buue

Buue
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But remember how little people are on the trade channel? Not sure if more people are upgrading outside of the channels, but we cant ask them right?

Edit: this is a downside, because we cant actually count how many people are affected by this cap...

Edited by SpicyBlobs, 20 March 2015 - 01:43 AM.

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#54
gansai

gansai
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Guys, just stop complaining. 80% is already generous enough as it is, Con could have reduced it to an even lower number, like 70% or 60%. Con has to make money, and yes, this update may reduce the premium key sales, which in theory would reduce the amount of money Con makes from this game. But, we are not Con, and we do not know what the finicial situation is. Con did what he thought is best and got backlash for it, and listened. He listened! That's more than I can say for some of the people on this forum complaining about this update. This game was a free to play in the begginng and will always be. One who plays a free to play cannot expect the benefits of a paid game.  It seems that a lot of you guys forgot that. A good free to play is one where you can get far in the game and acess most of the game without spending a single cent. This game fits that in my honest opinion.  This is my two cents

I agreed on the hard cap but not the base fuel cost for upgrading unique and rare,if what con said are true the other 95% player probably does not even know how 100% crafting bonus work since they does not go to trade or forum so they will upgrade unique or rare at the base price since most of them does not know how the upgrading work and i highly doubt 100% crafting off would do any impact to them because they dont go to trade so the only way to get unique are to loot them.the 80% hard cap are for the 5% of the player and i had no problem with it its just that the upgrading unique cost are way too unreasonable.


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#55
crazyeightyfive

crazyeightyfive
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A good point there gansai - Con has repeatedly said that those of us regularly in the chat (and I imagine it's fairly similar with regards to the Forums) represent only a tiny fraction of the playerbase.

 

If this is true, just how important is our tiny fraction to the game's bottom line?

 

Either we're insignificant, and thus don't truly matter (i.e. our cheap upgrades didn't really hurt the game), or we are far more significant than Con wants to admit (i.e. our fraction of the playerbase upgrading for free really DID hurt the game).

 

Either way, the cap on crafting/upgrading costs was inevitable, and frankly I wish people would just accept it - I remember the backlash when Vintages were made untradeable -people were going to quit, they were gonna flip - and now it's just something you see that occasionally gets explained to people who haven't played in a while, nothing more.

 

Although I also agree that maybe the upgrade cost should be looked at - Con has said they were determined some time ago - maybe worth going back and seeing if they shouldn't be changed now, considering the wealth of new features the game has?


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#56
Hatchford

Hatchford
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maybe the last time they were looked at was when the game was still capped at lvl 35 content.. or maybe even lvl 20 content!! could he have possible just scaled up the costs from when m24s at lvl 20 were the endgame weapon? either way, the bas cost of lvl 45 weapons are too expensive.


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#57
Zingman

Zingman
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When the M24 was king 50% Crafting on the Cheap was the only option, and it cost 500 fuel to upgrade it from level 20 to level 21.

 

The M107 is the top long rifle now, and with 80% off crafting by stacking boosts its exactly the same to upgrade it from 49 to 50.

 

Seems like the costs/cap are exactly where they should be to me...


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#58
Lanceyy

Lanceyy
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The M107 is the top long rifle now, and with 80% off crafting by stacking boosts its exactly the same to upgrade it from 49 to 50.

 

Seems like the costs/cap are exactly where they should be to me...

 

But what about all the other items close to lvl 50? they all cost exactly the same as M107 to upgrade.

 

Are you agreeing with the prices of all non M107 items too?


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#59
LLiquid

LLiquid
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But what about all the other items close to lvl 50? they all cost exactly the same as M107 to upgrade.

 

Are you agreeing with the prices of all non M107 items too?

 

Are you trying to say that Long Rifles (weapon of choice for the 10% or so who raid) should cost more than other weapons to upgrade? 

 

If upgrade costs are based on level, there should be no differentiation between weapon type.


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#60
Zingman

Zingman
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But what about all the other items close to lvl 50? they all cost exactly the same as M107 to upgrade.

 

Are you agreeing with the prices of all non M107 items too?

 

You completely missed the point.

 

When the max level for guns was level 21, upgrading costs for unique items were about 500 per level with crafting on the cheap (the only option).  All types of guns were upgraded, not just M-24s.

 

The current max for guns is level 50, stacking boosts reduces the cost to about 500 per level --- the exact same cost as when level 21 was max.

 

Back when level 21 was max, people upgraded their guns all the time.  They used 50% crafting on the cheap and paid 500 per level -- and considered it a bargain.

 

---

 

The perception that 500 per level is "too much" is colored by the fact that we've had a really bad exploit (1 fuel crafting) for the past six months.  Con should have capped it immediately -- but he didn't.


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