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Disarming Herc Mines ?

Island Herc Mines

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#1
gwn3030

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Running into a problem on The Island disarming the HERC mines. I figured my level 55 Engineer (trap disarming 46) should not have a problem with them but about 33% to 50% of the time during disarming, Boom and she is dead. Wearing a vest, Armor (injury chance -7.5, explosive resistance +55) or Vanguard (injury chance -30, health +25) does not offer enough protection.

 

So even at max skill, is there a random chance the HERC mines will blow regardless?

 

If so, I might be better off leaving my Engineer at the compound (since she can't earn her keep disarming them) and take another armored-up Fighter to run over them (at least my Fighter survives the blast doing that) if I can't avoid them.

Thanks


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#2
The Architect

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So even at max skill, is there a random chance the HERC mines will blow regardless?

 

If so, I might be better off leaving my Engineer at the compound (since she can't earn her keep disarming them) and take another armored-up Fighter to run over them (at least my Fighter survives the blast doing that) if I can't avoid them.

Thanks

 

Yes, they will.

 

That depends on you. If you prefer getting your fighter hurt instead maybe it's fine, as long as it works for you. 


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#3
HECU_Guy

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couple of questions towards your engineer:

1) what lvl is he/she????
2) what proper gear do you use with your engineer? 
3) perhaps MOST UNATTENDED/IMPORTANT QUESTION OF ALL: HOW LOW IS YOUR OVERALL/ENGINEER'S MORALE VALUE??????

with the last item being low as ****, don't expect your engineer to have much success defusing HERC traps ...

note: my engineer always has +26 morale (green smiley face next to engineer's name!) and comes up with 78-90% defuse success chances ... you may have to provide specific information in this area so that we can be of help ...


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#4
JamesNg2

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All it takes is one engineer failed disarming to turn your unique into a rare.  If an engineer has a 5% chance of dying when disarming compared to a fighter's 0% chance of dying, then its a no-brainer what you need to do.


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#5
The Architect

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I don't know what he did with his Engineer, my engineer survives with 44.6x% explosive resistance, and has at least 87% disarm chance. Granted full health turns to red health, but my engi doesn't die.

 

But hey, if you are doing that,  be sure to throw smoke grenades first if it's monitored by HERC. 


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#6
gwn3030

gwn3030
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Thanks for the replies

couple of questions towards your engineer:

1) what lvl is he/she????
2) what proper gear do you use with your engineer? 
3) perhaps MOST UNATTENDED/IMPORTANT QUESTION OF ALL: HOW LOW IS YOUR OVERALL/ENGINEER'S MORALE VALUE??????Level 55

M55

 I've tried  both rare Armor and a crafted Vanguard. See my first post for the specs,

I always run the Island at full Morale Valve for all survivors to be safe.

 

I don't know what he did with his Engineer, my engineer survives with 44.6x% explosive resistance, and has at least 87% disarm chance. Granted full health turns to red health, but my engi doesn't die.

 

But hey, if you are doing that,  be sure to throw smoke grenades first if it's monitored by HERC. 

I figured the 55% explosive resistance vest should at least let her survive the blast, but not in my case. I'll try smoke in case HERC are watching


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#7
314R

314R
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take a fighter, armor with high explosive resistance, and walk on herc mines..
faster and simpler


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#8
Ivan

Ivan
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my medic at lvl50 with 60% explosive resist survives a mine blast

 

your lvl55 engineer (guys who have hp almost the same as fighters) with 55% explosive resist was most likely shot by herc to death right after the explosion and you didnt notice it.


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#9
gwn3030

gwn3030
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But hey, if you are doing that,  be sure to throw smoke grenades first if it's monitored by HERC. 

your lvl55 engineer (guys who have hp almost the same as fighters) with 55% explosive resist was most likely shot by herc to death right after the explosion and you didnt notice it.

Thanks guys!

Yup, smoke worked and in looking  back, HERC 'overwatch' must have shot at the same time (or caused) as the mine blast.

I'm now enjoying the Island, just one small mistake (or complacency) and 'no 300 points for you'.


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#10
HECU_Guy

HECU_Guy
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Thanks for the replies

M55

 I've tried  both rare Armor and a crafted Vanguard. See my first post for the specs,

I always run the Island at full Morale Valve for all survivors to be safe.

 

I figured the 55% explosive resistance vest should at least let her survive the blast, but not in my case. I'll try smoke in case HERC are watching


dude, NEVER use VANGUARD on island maps ... always use armors with +55% explosive resistance ... well, +60% in your case (not to mention INJURY CHANCE REDUCTION ITEMS!)
My engineer carries a lvl 48 unique military armor with a HERC heavy helmet and a hallowed necklace, armed with a pulverizer - results are 70% total melee resistance, 55% injury reduction and 90% success on defusing HERC mines ... focus on injury chance as well, many tend to ignore this on non-fighters ...
 

take a fighter, armor with high explosive resistance, and walk on herc mines..
faster and simpler


TUT TUT ... injury chance-wise you mean?
 

my medic at lvl50 with 60% explosive resist survives a mine blast

 

your lvl55 engineer (guys who have hp almost the same as fighters) with 55% explosive resist was most likely shot by herc to death right after the explosion and you didnt notice it.


here comes proyectile resistance paired up with injury chance as well ... 

my solution to this last problem: go with a recon geared up with a base 57.5% injury reduction chance and nigh-70% bulletproof + 70% meleeproof ...  use a combat helmet and a mask and let the fun begin!

> this particular recon takes damage but very few injuries in combat ... making my medic's work easier! ;)


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#11
HECU_Guy

HECU_Guy
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I don't know what he did with his Engineer, my engineer survives with 44.6x% explosive resistance, and has at least 87% disarm chance. Granted full health turns to red health, but my engi doesn't die.

 

But hey, if you are doing that,  be sure to throw smoke grenades first if it's monitored by HERC. 


smoke makes no effect, traps have motion sensors, just "SERIOUSLY, DUDE?" ... lol

and regarding what I did to my engineer, I just patched her up so that she can endure playing the role of melee bait while my sniper team (scavenger and recon!) and support rifles (medic and fighter!) mow down any opposition ...

now, if only I could get a unique MSR 82 for the last part of the island ... -_-


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#12
HECU_Guy

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For once Architect had a point... He meant lay down smoke while disarming, so that if there are any HERC in range of the trap, they will not be shooting whilst he is disarming.


why using smoke when you can use line of sight to detect any HERC and snipe them down without delay?

or is it me being the only person sniping a HERC from one corner of the map away in the 2nd mission? - I swear, I found an unguarded trap later on where I had sniped the afforementioned HERC dude ... seems there are blind spots between walls/firing arc for certain weapons ...

> I can see he's got a point ... but I'd rather go for extreme caution and snipe anything nearby, unless the trap blocks the only way I can get through ...


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#13
The Architect

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> I can see he's got a point ... but I'd rather go for extreme caution and snipe anything nearby, unless the trap blocks the only way I can get through ...

 

 

Yeah, but there are certain sure-fire way to kill a suppressed HERC (because sometimes you just can't hit a damn thing with a certain suppressed HERC) -- by sending someone behind them to attack, you can quickly eliminate the survivor. But if there is a mine in the path, you can't do that.

 

HERC%20Mines_zpsgdhistac.png

 

The Brown line shows my path, the green Hs are the HERCs you would worry about in defusing. The yellow "M"s shows the mines. Those within a large circle usually indicates the area likely to have mines.

 

Upon the "M"s with White Arrows in my experience invariably have mines, and so i throw smoke grenades. Those near the Humvees usually have one, but at most times there is none.

 

Near the first Beacon, i usually throw my smoke grenade, so that i could have sufficient cover to line two of my fighters behind those two concrete cubes near the mine, the recon with her long-range weapon waits far back to not get suppressed, while the Engineer defuses and destroys the Beacon.

 

On the second arrow; near the exit area, there is usually two HERC troopers behind barricades, and is very close the mine, as well as there is just so much cramped space. It's advisable to disarm the mine before the usual HERC defeating routine, so that your Recon would have better angles without worrying of ever tripping the mine -- because it's already disarmed.'

 

Or at least that's how i do it in the variant of this HERC bridge


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#14
gwn3030

gwn3030
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smoke makes no effect, traps have motion sensors, just "SERIOUSLY, DUDE?" ... lol
 

I'm used smoke as I figured out (thanks to the help here on the board) I was getting snipped as I was disarming the mine, hence the boom and my Engineer not surviving even with 55% exp. res. armor (a combination of the shot from HERC and the blast).

I'm sure in the future I'll work on suppressing the HERC overwatch, but right now I'm playing super cautious and don't want to loss a survivor by a mine blast moving into position for that. I have a couple hundred smoke grenades, I might as well use them.


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#15
HECU_Guy

HECU_Guy
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Yeah, but there are certain sure-fire way to kill a suppressed HERC (because sometimes you just can't hit a damn thing with a certain suppressed HERC) -- by sending someone behind them to attack, you can quickly eliminate the survivor. But if there is a mine in the path, you can't do that.

 

HERC%20Mines_zpsgdhistac.png

 

The Brown line shows my path, the green Hs are the HERCs you would worry about in defusing. The yellow "M"s shows the mines. Those within a large circle usually indicates the area likely to have mines.

 

Upon the "M"s with White Arrows in my experience invariably have mines, and so i throw smoke grenades. Those near the Humvees usually have one, but at most times there is none.

 

Near the first Beacon, i usually throw my smoke grenade, so that i could have sufficient cover to line two of my fighters behind those two concrete cubes near the mine, the recon with her long-range weapon waits far back to not get suppressed, while the Engineer defuses and destroys the Beacon.

 

On the second arrow; near the exit area, there is usually two HERC troopers behind barricades, and is very close the mine, as well as there is just so much cramped space. It's advisable to disarm the mine before the usual HERC defeating routine, so that your Recon would have better angles without worrying of ever tripping the mine -- because it's already disarmed.'

 

Or at least that's how i do it in the variant of this HERC bridge


main question: what weapon and what range does your recon have???? 
secondary question: what do you suit your scavenger up with (in terms of weapons and gear!)?????

explanation: I've found out that scavengers are quite good at using sniper rifles ... I've began sending him first with 417 of 32 range and 3.16 aps - with great results!!!! - now, I swapped the 417 for a unique VS of 34.37 range and bonus damage per shot, only issue is minimum effective range (being it a somewhat large circle of 15 range where it loses its great potential!), but pays off in sniping what my recon can't snipe down ...

> what I've suited up my recon with (maybe it needs to be explained a bit for further analysis): unique full body armor and M107 with 40 range - I just need to move my recon a bit and he'll snipe down pretty much any HERC in his way

> my tactic near the "final arrow" on the map: I usually move my recon and scavenger to co-snipe any herc on sight,

1) the first HERC to go is the one bulked next to the exit (works every time I face them!)

2) then I casually move my recon at the center of the railway, between the barricade and the street section, the HERC next to the dark entrance falls in a good 6-8 shots (2-3 at the least!)

3) once the coverage of this area is deleted for good, I move my engineer to defuse the trap right in the middle of the street section - HERC's line of fire is shorter than the distance between the HERC MSR82 sniper and the mine!!!!

* important: ALWAYS USING RANGE TO YOUR ADVANTAGE - BUT BE ON THE LOOKOUT FOR MINIMUM EFFECTIVE RANGE! SOME WEAPONS WORK BETTER THAN OTHERS AT SOME MAPS, VS121 IS GOOD BUT IT HAS COSTED ME AN ISLAND RAID ONCE AT THE 2ND MISSION, YOU'D BE BETTER OFF USING VS's ON SCAVENGERS, LEAVE M107'S TO RECONS!

4) with the mine disabled, I move my recon and scavenger to the barricade close to the humvee stationed near the last beacon, at the side of the wall ... my tactic? well, HERC's here don't have enough cover on those sandbags and mixing powerful shots with rapid fire beyond their effective range literally ends them in a matter of 15 seconds at the most! - more to scavenge and to defuse ...

5) last 1 or 2 HERC's are next to the beacon, they fall quick through either one of the next methods:
> throwing smoke in front of them and sending a melee engineer (a pulverizer ends them in 1-3 blows! 2 if its a melee-armored fighter with same pulverizer!)
> just sniping them from afar - ideal range (again!) is 37 or higher ...

hope this works out for anybody else that reads this and hasn't yet reached the island ...


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#16
gwn3030

gwn3030
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Since I got ride of my Scavenger and replaced her with a Medic, I've been able to complete the Island all the time (not always with 300 as I have lost survivors to mines or pathing problems). I got ride of my M107 and now my Leader, Recon, Fighter all use Unique Assault Rifles with 29.5-30.6 range (about 285 DPS before modifiers) and my Medic has a Unique Assault Rifle with a 34.3 range (it has a lower DPS so not used by the others) and my Engineer has a  Pulverizer. It seems without the M107 I don't get the suppression invulnerability with the HERC (or maybe Con fix that?). I just recon with the Recon and then move my Leader, Fighter and the Recon to fight it out with the HERC. Bring up the Medic to heal during the battle and to add firepower. Since she had longer range, she can hang back and let the other three take the hits (and heal them). On HERC maps, the Engineer is doing the scavenging since there are not that many to do (and destroying beacons/doors/etc). On Zombie maps, the Engineer takes the brunt of the attacks (110% knockback with the Pulverizer) and they all scavenge during the lulls in attacks. 

On the Zombie maps, it sure is nice having 4 Assault Rifles as opposed to 3 and a M107.

Of course now that I have the mine problem understood/beat, I'll start mixing up my survivor's loadout, to see if other setups work better.


Edited by gwn3030, 21 September 2015 - 03:38 AM.

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#17
The Architect

The Architect
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main question: what weapon and what range does your recon have???? 
secondary question: what do you suit your scavenger up with (in terms of weapons and gear!)?????

 

My Recon has 40.93 -- Lv54 AK-105 with +50% Effective Range. I think those are better than bring LRs in the Island, because with more DPS allows you to deal with Zombies much better. Oh how i wish it was an RPK instead.

 

I don't use any scavenger in the Island. Any of your survivor is fine to scavenge, it will take longer but if you can't hold off the zombies that long, then you won't be able to hold the zombies at all.

 

In fact, these are my Union Raid Setup:

 

 - Leader: 112 Fighting Points, Uni Minigun with 1280-ish DPS,22 Range, only -12.5% MS.

Armor = +70% PR, +58% ER, and +5% MR. 2 M67 Grenades.

 

 - Fighter: Uni M60, 24 Range, 12 APS, +26% damage.

Armor = +70% PR and ER, +35% MR. 2 M67 Grenades.

 

 - Medic: Uni KS-25, 6 APS, +21% damage, 38 Capacity, 12 range.

Armor = +66% PR, and +2% carry capacity. 4 Smoke Grenades. 

 

 - Recon: Uni AK-105, 40.93 Range (+50% range).

Armor = +70% PR, +70% ER, +5% MR. 2 Smoke Grenades.

 

 - Engineer: Pulverizer with 82% KB.

Armor = +70% MR, +68% ER, +65% PR. 2 Smoke Grenades.

 


explanation: I've found out that scavengers are quite good at using sniper rifles ... I've began sending him first with 417 of 32 range and 3.16 aps - with great results!!!! - now, I swapped the 417 for a unique VS of 34.37 range and bonus damage per shot, only issue is minimum effective range (being it a somewhat large circle of 15 range where it loses its great potential!), but pays off in sniping what my recon can't snipe down ...

 

Not Necessary, any of your survivors can search. I also used to use VS-121 with my recon and it works wonders, but it's about the weapon itself not the survivor. But i suggest you to go for RPKs or AK-105 with + range, due to faster attacks it has better chance of hitting HERCs frequently, and at the same time offer better DPS for zombies.

 


> what I've suited up my recon with (maybe it needs to be explained a bit for further analysis): unique full body armor and M107 with 40 range - I just need to move my recon a bit and he'll snipe down pretty much any HERC in his way

 

Yeah sure. That's the one. But keep in mind the presence of HERC mines. Sure you can just snipe them away, but to give yourself peace of mind since you are moving around so much, defuse that too.

 

Since I got ride of my Scavenger and replaced her with a Medic, I've been able to complete the Island all the time (not always with 300 as I have lost survivors to mines or pathing problems). I got ride of my M107 and now my Leader, Recon, Fighter all use Unique Assault Rifles with 29.5-30.6 range (about 285 DPS before modifiers) and my Medic has a Unique Assault Rifle with a 34.3 range (it has a lower DPS so not used by the others) and my Engineer has a  Pulverizer. It seems without the M107 I don't get the suppression invulnerability with the HERC (or maybe Con fix that?). I just recon with the Recon and then move my Leader, Fighter and the Recon to fight it out with the HERC. Bring up the Medic to heal during the battle and to add firepower. Since she had longer range, she can hang back and let the other three take the hits (and heal them). On HERC maps, the Engineer is doing the scavenging since there are not that many to do (and destroying beacons/doors/etc). On Zombie maps, the Engineer takes the brunt of the attacks (110% knockback with the Pulverizer) and they all scavenge during the lulls in attacks. 

On the Zombie maps, it sure is nice having 4 Assault Rifles as opposed to 3 and a M107.

Of course now that I have the mine problem understood/beat, I'll start mixing up my survivor's loadout, to see if other setups work better.

 

Don't bother giving the Medic with Assault rifles with good range, unless it's the most DPSed weapon you can give him/her. Give her something with a good DPS despite having weak range, like a KS-25 or even LMG. As the only fight she should be participating in is against zombies. After all once your fighters are suppressed, your medic will also be shot at. As well as unless your are going to send your Melee, suppression is your enemy as the will get less likely hit if they don't get up from their cover.

 

Get your Engineer with +70% MR and ER, the PR is only a luxury you're not required to have since armed with Melee they will just get behind the HERC when everyone is suppressed and not shooting. 


Since at HERC maps all you need to do is snipe, or suppress and Melee behind, you only need a few high-ranged weapons, in fact just one as your LMG, or even Minigun is able to suppress HERC really fast.

 

Try Bringing a KS-25 and a Minigun, not only they add monstrous knock-back, they help with extreme DPS at Zombies. And the minigun has monstrous suppressive properties. Without modifications, my own Minigun reaches 1280-ish DPS, and that's equipped with an Armor.

 

All of your Armor must have both +70% PR and +70 ER, MR for the engineer, and anything else is a bad idea. Try saving up for 8 Lv3 keys, or 2 prems, in the Trade each good armor usually costs 2 prems or 4 Lv3 keys, if you have a 30-range M107 you might get 3 or 4 of them.


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#18
gwn3030

gwn3030
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Thanks for the tips. I will switch-out my load out for today's mission. I don't have lots of Unique Vest (only 2 with 70% PR) so 'we' have to make do with rare vests on the remaining survivors. I've never figured out the whole trading deal, so I have to make due with what we have scavenged. I am envious of a lot of the uniques that have been posted on the board, some awesome stuff there. Best minigun I have is a blue :*(


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#19
HECU_Guy

HECU_Guy
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My Recon has 40.93 -- Lv54 AK-105 with +50% Effective Range. I think those are better than bring LRs in the Island, because with more DPS allows you to deal with Zombies much better. Oh how i wish it was an RPK instead.

 

I don't use any scavenger in the Island. Any of your survivor is fine to scavenge, it will take longer but if you can't hold off the zombies that long, then you won't be able to hold the zombies at all.

 

In fact, these are my Union Raid Setup:

 

 - Leader: 112 Fighting Points, Uni Minigun with 1280-ish DPS,22 Range, only -12.5% MS.

Armor = +70% PR, +58% ER, and +5% MR. 2 M67 Grenades.

 

 - Fighter: Uni M60, 24 Range, 12 APS, +26% damage.

Armor = +70% PR and ER, +35% MR. 2 M67 Grenades.

 

 - Medic: Uni KS-25, 6 APS, +21% damage, 38 Capacity, 12 range.

Armor = +66% PR, and +2% carry capacity. 4 Smoke Grenades. 

 

 - Recon: Uni AK-105, 40.93 Range (+50% range).

Armor = +70% PR, +70% ER, +5% MR. 2 Smoke Grenades.

 

 - Engineer: Pulverizer with 82% KB.

Armor = +70% MR, +68% ER, +65% PR. 2 Smoke Grenades.

 

 

Not Necessary, any of your survivors can search. I also used to use VS-121 with my recon and it works wonders, but it's about the weapon itself not the survivor. But i suggest you to go for RPKs or AK-105 with + range, due to faster attacks it has better chance of hitting HERCs frequently, and at the same time offer better DPS for zombies.

 

 

Yeah sure. That's the one. But keep in mind the presence of HERC mines. Sure you can just snipe them away, but to give yourself peace of mind since you are moving around so much, defuse that too.

 

 

Don't bother giving the Medic with Assault rifles with good range, unless it's the most DPSed weapon you can give him/her. Give her something with a good DPS despite having weak range, like a KS-25 or even LMG. As the only fight she should be participating in is against zombies. After all once your fighters are suppressed, your medic will also be shot at. As well as unless your are going to send your Melee, suppression is your enemy as the will get less likely hit if they don't get up from their cover.

 

Get your Engineer with +70% MR and ER, the PR is only a luxury you're not required to have since armed with Melee they will just get behind the HERC when everyone is suppressed and not shooting. 


Since at HERC maps all you need to do is snipe, or suppress and Melee behind, you only need a few high-ranged weapons, in fact just one as your LMG, or even Minigun is able to suppress HERC really fast.

 

Try Bringing a KS-25 and a Minigun, not only they add monstrous knock-back, they help with extreme DPS at Zombies. And the minigun has monstrous suppressive properties. Without modifications, my own Minigun reaches 1280-ish DPS, and that's equipped with an Armor.

 

All of your Armor must have both +70% PR and +70 ER, MR for the engineer, and anything else is a bad idea. Try saving up for 8 Lv3 keys, or 2 prems, in the Trade each good armor usually costs 2 prems or 4 Lv3 keys, if you have a 30-range M107 you might get 3 or 4 of them.



>>> biggest question ever: Shotguns ... on a MEDIC???? range is KEY, AR is better (even if it's an AK or a 416, the latter which I happen to be plagued by!)

> question "not-as-big": I know AK105 works wonders ... but bare in mind not all ppl have 50% ranged unique AK's (just got mine from the hands of a friendly player thru chat 2 nights ago! wonders of luck, huh?) ... not gonna ask for the ammo cost but I have a doubt there on your part (do tell!) ...

point is, have you even tried passing the island using 2 AR's and 2 LR's without failing? be honest about it, Archie (if it's okay to nickname you Archie!) :P


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#20
The Architect

The Architect
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>>> biggest question ever: Shotguns ... on a MEDIC???? range is KEY, AR is better (even if it's an AK or a 416, the latter which I happen to be plagued by!)

> question "not-as-big": I know AK105 works wonders ... but bare in mind not all ppl have 50% ranged unique AK's (just got mine from the hands of a friendly player thru chat 2 nights ago! wonders of luck, huh?) ... not gonna ask for the ammo cost but I have a doubt there on your part (do tell!) ...

point is, have you even tried passing the island using 2 AR's and 2 LR's without failing? be honest about it, Archie (if it's okay to nickname you Archie!) :P

 

Yes you can give your medic a Shotgun, unless you have a better DPSed weapon. Else you won't be able to utilize the range of the AR since you are supposed to hide her until you need to heal.

 

Yeah, but really though AK-105 is better, it has smaller minimum range at the same base range of 25 which is the same of the VS. Having 30% bonus range puts the range to at least 34 which his more than enough.

 

I have a -50% AC book, i guess not everybody has that.

 

Call me "Arc". And no i have not won the island with two LRs, just one LR and that was a VS, the very same setup as above replacing the AK-105 until i got the AK-105.


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